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Published: 06 August 2004

“The symbol of The Orb is a round circle with a cross on top, it’s quite an important sign that’s been used for millenniums. It dates back to the Pre-Egyptian days of Sumerian and Mesopotamian culture.” 15 years after he gave up roadying to concentrate on building ambient house giants The Orb, Alex Patterson remains one of dance culture’s most enigmatic, highly developed souls, as comfortable discussing chill-out as he is ancient Sumerian History and the future of the world.

“My missing link at the moment is that we don’t go to Heaven unless we’re complete,” he suggests.

“Our own egos have to belief that something happens after death, because we’re much too intelligent just to die. What we need to find is some kind of formula that gives us longevity in life so that we can actually reproduce the real power in our brains. But it that happened, we’d all become genuine supermen and there would be far too much of an overspill of population. So right now it’s still about keeping that formula from ancient alchemy, down.”

Equally happy discussing the background of Stonehenge (he’s recently returned from visiting Ireland’s equivalent Neolithic structure Newgrange) he’s nevertheless resolutely down-to-Earth and quick to downplay his alchemical knowledge.

“It’s not about me knowing this or that, it’s rather about me reading books, learning about these issues and discussing them with friends,” he explains.

“I’m not a person who philosophises, I just read things and try and connect them together. If I had the money I’d love to become and explorer and go on adventures, to find ancient cities in the jungle. But it’s not the 19th century.”

Instead he continues to make music, such as he brand new Orb album Bicycles and Tricycles, which sees him returning to the four/four ambient dub style he first pioneered in the late 80s.

“I’m 44 years old and I find it magical to be 44 and playing 4/4 music a lot,” he quips.
 
“I am 44, I shall play 4/4.”

Chuckling as he ponders such numerological coincidences, he admits he’s chilling out even more as time passes.

“I think I’ve slowed down a lot since when I started, I give myself more time, that’s something that happens when you reach 40. You suddenly realise all the rushing around doesn’t really matter,” he says.

While it might not matter much now, Patterson’s energy in the past helped make the Orb one of dance culture’s most significant, indeed popular bands of the 90s, their number one albums and Glastonbury headlining live shows putting them firmly on a par with their peers of the era Underworld, Orbital and Leftfield. However, as corporate forces took musical control as the millennium approached, The Orb’s relentless experimentation saw them being relatively marginalized though not before Alex duetted with Robbie Williams in a bizarre version of the Bee Gees ballad I Started A Joke.

“Robbie’s someone who, if I met him again, we’d have a coffee, a chat and a laugh, I still regard him as a kind of mate in that sense, because he’s that kind of bloke, he’s not a pretentious pop star,” says Alex.

“The funny thing was he first saw us when we were on Top Of The Pops playing chess, years ago- all day, because he was there performing with Take That. He told me that when he next saw us playing live that summer he was so impressed that he decided he wanted to do a tune with us.”

Odd collaborations aside, though, he’s nowadays back to collaborating with Orb originals Jimmy Cauty (of KLF fame), Thomas Fehlmann and long term collaborator Simon Phillips and will soon be touring the UK as a band in May. Though not before he’s completed a 16 date DJing solo tour of Australia.

Skrufff (Jonty Skrufff): You’re shortly off to Australia for a DJ tour, how does DJing compare to playing live as a band?

The Orb: “As a DJ I will be playing Orb music, I think that’s probably what they want me to do, though I actually find DJing much more difficult than performing with the band, because you can’t hide behind anyone. It’s two hours of sheer concentration, I concentrate with the Orb too but you can have more of a laugh than when you’re on your own- there’s no cover.”

Skrufff: you’ve got an extensive back catalogue to choose from, do you sometimes find yourself thinking ‘Oh God, I’ve got to play Little Fluffy Clouds again?

The Orb: “It gets like that now and again, it’s bound to. It’s just when I go out sometimes people say ‘this is the bloke who did Little Fluffy Clouds’. It’s a talisman but it’s also been a great salesman for me, it’s opened so many doors for The Orb. I can’t say ‘I fucking hate it’, because that’s what you want me to say, because that’s a good journalistic line. I actually regard Little Fluffy Clouds and A Huge Ever Growing Pulsating Brain as the two main cornerstones of The Orb. If it wasn’t for those two tracks we wouldn’t have got anywhere, the other tracks would have been seen as being just good tracks, whereas those two are the excellent ones.”

Skrufff: How do you see acid house culture, now that it’s 15 years old?

The Orb: “I consider it to be a way of life, I see it all over the world, it’s still springing up everywhere. I’ve toured China, I’ve been doing a regular club in Moscow, all last year and I’ve been to places like Macedonia, all because of the music. I find it’s all opening up and it’s still fresh. In Australia it’s still fresh too. I played the Earthcore party on the millennium and that was magical. I’ll never forget that one.”

Skrufff: Do you ever look back and thing you should have done things differently?

The Orb: “I think everybody has regrets but you can’t really change it, you’ve just got to make sure it doesn’t’ happen again. I don’t really have regrets- though if I started again I would never trust anybody (chuckling).”

Skrufff: Do you see yourself as being involved in music until the end?

The Orb: “I think so, yeah, particularly when I go and see Kraftwerk play and know that Killing Joke are doing gigs this year, I think I can carry on for a few years yet. I think having a couple of classic albums under my belt has put me in the right sort of company.”

Bicyles & Tricycles is out on new label The Hexus shortly (check the website for release dates, which vary widely for different countries).

http://www.theorb.com

http://www.glasson.com/sights/newgrange.htm  (Newgrange: Built some 5,300 years ago, this holy place is one of the oldest built structures in the world. The tomb is the passage grave which on the morning of the winter solstice becomes filled with the dawn sunlight for one memorable moment every year. At all other times of the year the tomb of a shrouded in darkness . . .’) 

Interview By: Jonty Skrufff (Skrufff.com)

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Published: 06 August 2004

Nag Nag Nag’s Next Star? 12 months after he started door-whoring London’s still oversubscribed, always interesting, alternative club Nag Nag Nag, man-with-the-clipboard Mr Cormack stepped up to the decks, joining John Taylor’s Punx Soundcheck crew as a fledging new electro (clash) DJ. And 8 months later, the expat Irishman spins monthly at The Ghetto’s equally fashionable gay/ electro weekly The Cock and beyond, while continuing to bar undesirables from Nag every Wednesday (notably Christina Aguilera and Irish boy band Westlife).

“There are nights you think it should be called Blag, Blag, Blag, the stories people come out with trying to get in,” he laughs.

“I’ve had girls groping my cock, trying to get in, people offering me money and drugs. Sometimes some of them get embarrassed by what they say, comments like ‘do you know who I am?’ Actually, only one person has ever said that to me; Kylie Minogue’s ex-boyfriend, what was his name, James Gooding? I said ‘Yes, I do know who you are and you’re not coming in’.”

“I’ve also been spat at in the street once,” he chuckles, “It happened when I was walking through Soho Square on day.”

Skrufff: (Jonty Skrufff) How long have you been DJing for?

Mr Cormac: “Not long, just a few months. I’ve been into dance music for seven years or so and I was previously a club podium dancer which made me understand I was more interested in the music than the movement. The DJing all came about through opportunity and good luck. I’d bought some decks and learned how to beat mix and found I really enjoyed it. Though I was actually offered my first proper gig before I could beat mix, to be honest, which I’ve since found out is quite common amongst lots of DJs who are nowadays well known. It’s a good way to learn, to make all your fuck-ups right at the start and also to get through the fear of getting up there and doing it. My first gig was at The Cock, eight months ago.”

Skrufff: How did the Cock gig come about?

Mr Cormac: “I’d been doing a project with John Taylor from Punx Soundcheck and part of that project was making music as a band, he was already doing the first Friday of the month as a Punx Soundcheck night at The Cock and he offered me the gig as a monthly thing. Everything progressed from there. My second gig was at Cock Live at The Face magazine party which was even better, I loved it. That was the first time I really saw people reacting to what I was playing and dancing and that was when I really got into DJing. I’d had so many lost moments myself dancing in clubs and to be able to create that atmosphere and effect as a DJ was amazing.”

Skrufff: You started from zero; how did you decide what records and what style to play as a DJ?

Mr Cormac: “I started from a position of playing dance music predominantly, though I’d also got into the whole electro thing a few years ago and by the time I started going to Nag I was so ready for it, it was so overdue. For years I’d been going out on the hard house/ tribal gay scene and had got so blatantly bored, so when I started hearing electro, with its tongue-in-cheek, more fun vibe I was immediately into it and knew that it was a scene I wanted to get involved in.”

Skrufff: When did you first move from Northern Ireland to London?

Mr Cormac: “I grew up in a little town called Banbridge, near Belfast, which was where I started clubbing and had my first foray into dance music and all that comes with it; the good and the bad, the natural and the unnatural. I was a podium dancer in those hard house clubs of the time (chuckling), I was about 16 or 17 then. Clubbing really inspired me to move to London, actually much more than the gay scene.”

Skrufff: How old were you when you came to London?

Mr Cormac: “I was 20 and came over not knowing anybody, I came here for a bit of freedom I wasn’t feeling it at home. It was quite challenging for my Mum to deal with my sexuality, being based in a small town, at that time. I felt out on a limb when I first got here and felt I had nothing to lose, which was great. So I jumped in at the deep end, starting working at an all night café on Old Compton Street, doing the night shift. From there I started going out clubbing loads and started finding out which clubs interested me.”

Skrufff: How did you end up doing Nag’s door?

Mr Cormac: “I met Jonny (Slut) in Brighton when he was trying to get another club he was involved with, Marvellous, off the ground there. I’d gone to Brighton after travelling in India, wanting somewhere a little quieter than London and I ended up being so fucking bored, it was terrible. I’m not into pub culture and found it really hard to live somewhere after London because I still wanted to be social. So I started going to Marvellous regularly; started flyering for him, then when Nag got going I got into the club via Fil (Fil Ok, who co-promotes the club with JoJo De Freq). I remember Fil being  quite excited about this club he was doing, and when he was telling me I was listening to a Dave Clarke CD called World Sessions. When I went to Nag they were playing it and I was blown away. At that stage, I didn’t think the club was going to be huge or crazy, I don’t think anybody did, but I liked it anyway. Then when Nag moved to The Ghetto, bigger and bigger crowds started arriving at the door every week so I said to Jonny, ‘you need a door person, I’m going to do it for you’.”

Skrufff: Had you worked a club door before?

Mr Cormac: “I’d done it sporadically at various cheesy celeb type clubs, places like Kabaret. Doing the door at Nag felt right and I wanted to be involved. It was a good challenge for me, it’s been a real insight into what people are like (chuckling). There are nights you think it should be called Blag, Blag. Blag, the stories people come out with. People say they work for magazines, I’ve had girls groping my cock, trying to get in, people offering me money or drugs. It’s not so crazy now, though there was a period about a year ago when it was absolute mayhem.”

Skrufff: Did you really refuse entry to the boy band Westlife?

Mr Cormac: “Yeah we did and also Christina Aguilera once. Westlife just turned up at the door one night and to be perfectly honest, I didn’t recognise them, though I kinda’ did after I’d refused them, and I didn’t want to back down then (chuckling). But when I first saw them my first reaction was ‘those guys look like they’re out on a stag night, they looked dodgy’. The security stopped them initially and said ‘do you know this is a gay club’ and one of them said ‘I can tie my t shirt in a knot’ and was actually being quite witty. At the end of it all they didn’t seem that bothered, and weren’t that phased, I don’t think they’d set their sights on going to Nag, Nag, Nag, I think they’d rather stumbled into it.”

Skrufff: What happened with Christine Aguilera?

Mr Cormac: “With Christina Aguilera we have a mutual friend, and she phoned me saying ‘Christina wants to come down tonight, can she come with us?’ I said ‘of course she can come’ but she wanted to bring four or five security people with her. Jonny and I talked about it and we decided that we thought four or five security was a bit unnecessary in a club like Nag, Nag, Nag. It doesn’t fit with the feeling of the club; people should come down and leave their shit at the door. Christina’s response was that she didn’t use the bathroom without her security, so I don’t think we missed anything.”

Mr Cormac DJs at the Punx Souncheck night at the Cock, Ghetto, the first Friday of the month and door whores Nag, Nag, Nag every Wednesday (also at the Ghetto. Falconberg Court, Soho).

http://www.punxsoundcheck.com

Interview By: Jonty Skrufff (Skrufff.com)

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Published: 06 August 2004

You Don’t Need To Be Famous To Write About Fame. Staring off the cover of DJ magazine’s latest issue, Miss Kittin (aka ‘Dark Little Poet’ aka  ‘artist, pop star, DJ, electroclash survivor and poet’, as DJ dub her) is both famous and presumably well used to riding round in limos, though chatting to Benedetta Skrufff she insists she’s only done it once.

“It happened with Sven Vath after I’d worked with him, I went to see him playing and later he invited me to an after party,” she reveals.

“The people from his office had rented a limo with zebra seats for him as a birthday present, so there were ten of us in the car and it was really funny being driven along the highway. Especially when we had to stop at service stations because all ten of us were desperate for a pee. But it was nothing like I imagined in the song.”

And significantly, when she dreamed up her seminal electroclash lyrics, her life was as far from limousines, Frank Sinatra and even Sven Vath, as any Hollywood rags to riches clubbing narrative could contrive

“Just picture this scene,” she says (sounding exactly as she does on the records- her regular voice is exactly the same).

“I used to go to many illegal parties all night, and I’d go home, still on drugs, switch on the TV and watch the music channels, and all you’d see would be those hip hop guys in limos, surrounded by girls in bikinis. There I was, all super dirty, wearing my army boots, shaved head, off my head, watching these videos . . . of course I laughed at them, and eventually I decided to write my feelings down.”

As well as writing Frank Sinatra during her early morning comedowns, she also penned the limousine themed lyrics to Felix Da Housecat’s genre crossing anthem Silver Screen Shower Scene, which both kick-started electroclash and changed Kittin’s own life irrevocably, when the track became one of the biggest club hits of 2000.

“When my career begun I never thought it would have taken this turn, I never even thought I would have become a DJ,” she admits.

“I started making music with The Hacker, decided to talk on some tracks and next we meet DJ Hell. He asks for music; we deliver him music . . . bang, the rest is history. And then there’s this legendary Chicago DJ who wants me to put some vocals on his new album, and sure, of course I do it.”

And four years after Felix took her in the studio for his album she’s sitting in a Central London luxury hotel to talk about her own album, a highly eclectic record called I com that encompasses hip hop, techno, electroclash and her own unique sensibilities and slant on life.

Skrufff (Benedetta Ferraro): “The album is really varied in style, did you create it with one specific vision?

Miss Kittin: “The whole concept for the album was to include a lot of influences that inspire me as a DJ or as a music lover and if you think about it, it’s like my DJ sets. I literally went to the studio with a book of notes and went through all my ideas, one by one, with one of the producers Thies Mynther and we picked together the ones we thought would work. I told him what I had in mind musically, he then pointed out which styles would work best with whichever lyrics I had noted in my book. He made it easy, because we had a guideline to combine the music with this sort of imaginary world I had already jotted down in my notebook. It was fun. Perhaps some people thought I made this album in order to impose myself as an artist, which I can assure you is not true. I loved the collaboration and the input I have received throughout.”

Skrufff: Did you consider involving The Hacker more closely?

Miss Kittin: “No really, because I don’t think he would have liked to follow me in all these crazy, different styles I explored. That’s not his philosophy, so I did it on my own. He did, however, collaborate on one of the tracks.”

Skrufff: People now have a certain image or idea of you, how conscious were you of people’s expectations?

Miss Kittin: “That didn’t concern me. I wasn’t conscious about it because I’m not interested in this part of the job. Everybody thought it was risky for me to expose myself, but if you don’t take risk, you never do anything. Everyday life imposes a certain code of behaviour on you, sometimes you want to shout in the middle of the street, but you don’t do it because you don’t want people to think you’re crazy. As an artist though, you need to express yourself in the most genuine way, so the answer is to just do it. I’m pretty good at that.”

Skrufff: All your previous records seem to reflect this untainted approach with your vocals recorded on top of the tracks, seeming to tell a story . . .

Miss Kittin: “Sure, that’s because I recorded them spontaneously. That’s the key to everything I do. If I think too much about things, if I start to intellectualise, then I loose it. For instance, when I did (mix CD) ‘Radio Caroline’ I had just moved to Berlin, I had all my possessions scattered on the floor, and I was in that frame of mind. I was honest, there was nobody there to judge me so I went with the flow, I had confidence in myself, and in what I was doing. Of course, by being honest sometimes you might end up being a bit cheesy too, but that’s the charm of spontaneity. If you’re interested in someone, then you should also be interested in their faults.”

Skrufff: How did you develop this confidence in yourself?

Miss Kittin: “It develops over the years and probably it started when I was very young, when I used to shut myself in my room, making my own private world. I used to draw and paint, a lot of my time was spent creating things, and my granddad was also an artist, so he was very inspiring to me. Then I became independent, had my experiences and for sure, like any artist I had problems with authority, nevertheless I did what I needed to do. I think it all came from me trusting my own intuition and following this driving force I have inside me. It may all look crazy from the outside, but in the end everybody had to agree with me. We all have this ability, but people give up too easily because our society doesn’t encourage abstract thinking, everything is expected to fall into the ranks. To me though, that’s the essence of being an artist.”

Skrufff: There’s a method in your madness then . . ?

Miss Kittin: “Absolutely. There’s no point in acknowledging your energy if you don’t channel it somehow. I try not to waste my energy, instead I’ve learned every time to go a little bit further inside myself and I’m proud of that. The process seems more interesting that the final result, because it’s a lifetime work.”

Skrufff: DJ mag describes you (amongst other things) as a ‘pop star’, is that a term you’re comfortable with?

Miss Kittin: “I don’t describe myself as a pop star; not at all. Though I can understand why people would say that because I think I represent something the market was waiting for. For some reason, I don’t know why yet, I came at the right time in the right place, and now I’m here.”

Skrufff: Is it a good or bad thing?

Miss Kittin: “I think it’s good. If you succeed in what you do it’s definitely good, if you don’t it means you’re on the wrong path. I won’t complain if people take an interest in me and what I do; of course not. The reaction was a little extreme though, but I think that’s a reflection of the times we’re living in where people project themselves on to celebrities. I don’t have a problem if some people recognise themselves in what I do, but as soon as that happens, there you have it: pop music. The moment people start singing your song in the shower it becomes pop music. This I understand, but I’m not ready to follow the rules of the market, so in that respect I don’t consider myself a pop star, no.”

Skrufff: Do you tend to follow the rules more as a DJ?

Miss Kittin: “To a certain degree, yes, I think I do, not as a singer though and that’s why it works for me. On the same token, how many people have tried to imitate me and have not succeeded? There must be a reason of ‘why me’? But I’m not here to judge, I don’t make that my business. I leave that job to journalists and critics… they are here to analyse, aren’t they?”

Skrufff: Am I here to analyse you? I knew I wanted to be a journalist since I was 6 years old, and I still doing it for the love of meeting special people . . .

Miss Kittin: “That’s brilliant. I also love meeting special people, but once I also wrote ‘never meet your idols’… because it’s never the way you think it is. I love the fact that people can have their own idea of who I am. Nobody needs to know my personal life. Would you like the masses to know what you do and who you’re fucking? I don’t think so.”

Skrufff: On the subject of fame “Frank Sinatra” certainly came out from a burst of imagination, and you wrote that before being famous . . .

Miss Kittin: “True. I do have a vivid imagination, for sure. Was I a visionary in that moment? Who knows. That was one of the first songs I ever wrote, where I came out with that ‘speaking’ thing. You don’t really need to be famous to write about fame, and when you are famous you tend not to talk about it.”

Skrufff: How do you feel looking at your picture on the cover of DJ magazine in a red low cut dress, red lips et all?

Miss Kittin: “It’s a nightmare; honestly it is, but I don’t think I’m alone on this one, I truly believe it’s every woman’s problem. So here I go, look at my wrinkles, the outfit is too small and it won’t fit, I look so fat, my skin looks bad; I hate it. I don’t even pretend not to care about my image because in a way I do, not that I care about what people think, but I do care about how I feel inside. If I feel good, then everything is OK. The truth is I don’t look good in photos and I never did. I never liked being photographed and I think I never will. As a woman you carry this weight, a man can get away with going on a shoot looking dishevelled, we can’t.”

Skrufff: You’ve managed pretty well so far though, I’m thinking about that nurse outfit you used to wear, for example . . .

Miss Kittin: “When I started playing out live with The Hacker, nobody wanted to see a girl with a microphone on the stage. Techno parties with a girl singing live? Err, don’t think so. So I had to use any weapon in order to bring attention on us. Michel was all right behind the keyboards, but I had the rough end of it… and I still do. So I went and spent £30 in a fetish shop for that nurse outfit, which I wore four times, and six years later people are still asking me about it. This is just to show you the power of image.”

Skrufff: Do you feel more comfortable on a stage rather than in front of the camera? Presumably, you’ll have to perform live at some stage?

Miss Kittin: “I feel at my best when I’m DJing, but as far as performing, no, I’m not obliged to do it. Of course, the record company would love me to and I think that people would like to see me performing live, though right now, it’s the last thing on my mind. I feel exhausted even thinking about being on the road. On the other hand, I don’t want to make a mistake. As an electronic music artist I’d have to hire live musicians, gear up the whole show, which can easily be a failure. Maybe in a year’s time, but for now DJing is what I know best, so why not continue with that and make it even more special?”

Skrufff: Do you still feel DJing is something selfish?

Miss Kittin: “Oh yes, and music is too. If you do it for the people who come to see you, you’d become addicted to the crowd and that could become a problem. When I was younger, I used to think that as a DJ you should educate people by playing more obscure tracks, for example. Then I met Eric Krug, this French DJ who really put it into perspective for me. “Educate?” He asked me. “Who do you think you are?” I remember taking it really badly at the time, then I understood he was right. The most honest way to do it is by having fun doing it, as an entertainer you should, first of all, entertain yourself.”

Skrufff: Why do you always go on about Laurent Garnier?

Miss Kittin: “Because he’s been a very inspirational and influential figure in my life. I used to go and see him every Thursday with my friends who knew him and even then he’s always been very friendly to me. Of course, in time we have become good friends and he’s always given me plenty of good advice. To be a good DJ you must have a big heart and Laurent certainly has it. He’s a giver and you can witness that whenever he plays, as he manages to sexually charge the atmosphere, he amazes me. It’s always a big lesson for me to see him playing.”

Skrufff: Your have talked at length about having been exploited when you first started. Is it right that you got no money at all from all your Felix Da Housecat tracks?

Miss Kittin: “When my career begun I never thought it would have taken this turn, I never even thought I would have become a DJ. Then, I start making music with The Hacker and I decided to talk on the tracks, next we meet DJ Hell, he asks for music, we deliver him music… bang, the rest is history. Then there’s this legendary Chicago DJ who wants me to put some vocals on his new album, and sure, of course I do it. Then again, there’s another producer from Zurich, who also heard what I’ve done with Michel, he also wants me to do something, also he’s not too far away and he’s a friend… so there we go again. Of course, the more you do the more experienced you become, but then there has to be a limit, otherwise you become a microphone whore. In my collaborations it’s never been the case that I sing, then I leave. I always write my own lyrics, I’m always behind the music, I want to know what they do with my voice, as a DJ I have a sense of how the arrangements should work and when the voice should come in, and of course if I’m not there it becomes very frustrating for them.”

Skrufff: Did you get any money from that Detroit Grand Pubbhas track, “After School Special”?

Miss Kittin: “That was also a very strange scenario. Their label asked me for vocals for an artist I really loved. I did the job, sent the tape to the label in Detroit, Detroit Grand Pubbhas were in the office when my tape was played, so they asked if they could keep it. At the label they said yes without asking me, but as it turned out the track sounded great, so I was at least happy about that. When Detroit Grand Pubbhas signed for an album deal with a big record label, I was still without contract so it was a horror to clear the whole thing up. Since Detroit Grand Pubbhas are no longer with that label, their lawyers are urging my lawyers to sign whatever contract they have, because it’s either that or nothing at all. I have learned my lesson, for sure. Now I don’t do anything without a contract unless I know the artist very well, and even then you can never be too sure. Obviously you have to take risks if you want to work and I don’t regret anything, because it’s all been part of the process and I was very lucky because I’ve retained my name. I’m still Miss Kittin.”

Miss Kittin’s debut album I Com is out on May 17, on Mute Records.

http://www.misskittin.com

Interview By: Benedetta Skrufff (Skrufff.com)

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Published: 06 August 2004

I Almost Quit DJing After Leaving Radio 1. When acid house pioneer Danny Rampling chatted to Skrufff just months after leaving Radio 1 in 2002, he spoke optimistically about his DJing future, though two years on, he admits it wasn’t such an easy change to navigate as he hoped. “I felt totally demoralised, I was ready to give everything up, for a time I really felt like I’d had enough of it all,” he reveals.

“Though as time’s gone on I’ve realised that I’m stronger than that and the Radio 1 experience was just a minor glitch in a huge picture,” says Danny.

“Music is in my blood, especially house music,” he declares. “I live it”.

Finding inspiration through his keen interest in astrology (‘I find it can help when your direction wanders, it can give you signs and point you in the right direction on the path of life’) he’s now firmly back on track as he launches his new London club night Union, on May 1st at the Cross.

“The name totally signifies what the club’s all about, it’s a statement, it’s about bringing people together, the DJs and audience alike; people that really believe in the music,” he explains.

“House music in recent times has taken some bad knocks across the press and in clubland as a whole but that’s been going on for over a year and it’s got rid of a lot of the driftwood. I think house is gathering strength again, it’s had its downturn and we’re coming out the other side again.”

The new club also opens just three months after the birth of his first child, an event that’s affected both him and his plans for Union.

“I think becoming a father has enhanced my spirit musically, I’m so much happier in my life generally and when you reach that state of happiness and inner peace, then that comes through in the music,” he says.

“Currently I’m playing a lot more soulful music and that’s the musical direction I see for Union. I want it to be about beautiful, lovely soulful music, from deep house to Latin to Afro to jazzy house. I’m thinking about clubs I’ve been out to in places like New York, such as Body & Soul in more recent times, and Lazy Dog in London, my dream is to capture those kind of atmospheres.”

Skrufff (Jonty Skrufff): You previously ran Metrogroove at Turnmills up until the end of last year, why did you feel the need to change from Metrogroove to Union?

Danny Rampling: “ spent three years at Turnmills and I needed to retain total direction of a night but unfortunately that was lost at Metrogroove last year, I didn’t really have too much input there by the end. So we can to an amicable end and I’ve moved on. Now, it’s all down to me, I’ll be pushing the new club in the direction that I feel is correct and proper.”

Skrufff: Given that you’re back in full control, what exactly is the new vision for Union?

Danny Rampling: “I’d like to aim for a club that appeals to an audience who are really into the music, firstly; it’s not about the way you look or who you are and it’s certainly not about drugs either. I think that drugs in London clubs, and in clubs in general, have suffocated a lot of the goodness in the scene, especially cocaine; cocaine is just terminally boring. We’ll be doing four Union parties a year and they’ll be a US guest DJ for each of those parties, supported by UK and European talent. The whole idea is to bring together a decent crowd of people that love music as well as hopefully attracting a good mix of people. I’m not implementing any strict door policies, as long as people don’t look like football hooligans, they can come in.”

Skrufff: How do you set about attracting a crowd these days?

Danny Rampling: “Principally by working a lot with flyers, 30,000 flyers have already gone out. There are less and less angles to promote a night these days, it’s really reverted back to how it was in the beginning, in a sense. You’ve got to get out there at ground level and work very hard with flyers. That’s always been the way for any clubs I’ve been involved with, plus good art direction too. The flyer represents the mood of the club and what it’s about, it’s a very colourful flyer, it incorporates London, nightlife and fashion and is intended to draw a good mix of people; gay, straight, black and white.”

Skrufff: Lots of small alternative clubs like Nag, The Cock, Drama and Electrogogo have sprung up around electro in the last couple of years, have you been inspired much by that scene?

Danny Rampling: “I’ve been meaning to go to Nag, Nag, Nag since it opened because some of my friends go there regularly, but I feel like I’ve missed out there, in a sense, turning up two or three years later. I’m a little bit embarrassed by the fact I’ve not been there, to be honest. And now that I’ve got a child it’s very difficult to even go out at all right now, it’s all very new for me, getting familiar with the role of being a parent.”

Skrufff: Are you a hands-on, changing nappies kind of father?

Danny Rampling: “Yes I’ve changed a few, though not every day. I do get involved, it’s a joint effort with my girlfriend and we’re both ecstatic, it’s such a great change of direction. I made a lot of changes in my lifestyle at the beginning of last year, and cut out a lot of things then suddenly all of this has happened. Spiritually, it’s so rewarding. Every day I wake up and there’s my son, smiling at me. That’s worth more than anything in this world, it’s precious; we’re really cherishing these days.”

Skrufff: Seb Fontaine was talking about fatherhood to Skrufff recently and mentioned he’s conscious of avoiding war zones or dangerous places, because of his kids . . .

Danny Rampling: “I think he’s got the right attitude there because you do look at the world very differently when you’ve got kids, it gives you a completely different outlook on life and the safety of your family becomes paramount. I’m also refusing to go to dangerous places now, what’s the point of going to somewhere like Tel Aviv where people are being blown up on buses at the moment? That’s happening regularly, do you really need to put yourself at that risk? It’s a great place to go and play but when you’ve got kids it becomes a whole different world. In the past I was relaxed about it all but now I wouldn’t go anywhere where there’s conflict going on, it’s just not worth it.”

Skrufff: You’ve maintained a presence in Italy for years, does it remain a key territory for you?

Danny Rampling: “I still go there occasionally, I love Italy, my girlfriend’s Italian and I really have a passion for Italian culture, I’ve been playing there since 1988, when I went there with Norman Jay and I remember being amazed at the quality of the clubbing out there. Italy still retains that, I noticed Benny Benassi told you Italian clubs are all about champagne culture, well I don’t know where the fuck he’s been playing in Italy. OK, like here, if you want to go and play on that champagne bar scene, it’s there, however, like in the UK, there are a lot of good underground clubs and there is still a very strong club culture in Italy. The crowds are very responsive and they know their music, and what they’re into currently is much more the electronic driven sounds. They love electroclash and music with an electronic edge, that’s what ruling in Italy right now.”

Skrufff: I read about you owning over 40,000 records, which must take up a huge amount of space physically, where do you store them?

Danny Rampling: “I keep them in a cellar, I did in fact move on from a large number of records last year, I sold the whole of my trance collection, apart from a few key records, because there was no point holding on to them. I cleared out a lot of early US house and practically all of the trance records, which came to about 7,000 trance records. I didn’t have enough space and the decision had to be made, there’s order in the cellar again now.”

Skrufff: How long did it take to select 7,000 obsolete trance records?

Danny Rampling: “My assistant helped me out and we went through all the racks one by one and broke them down. They all went off to one person. The whole of Tony De Vit’s remix collection was in it too. They’ve gone to another record collector/ DJ who’ll be putting them to good use. There were a lot of rare trance records also included but they’re no use to me anymore. Playing 150/160bpm trance is a period I went through which I loved but I’m not going to be doing it again.”

Skrufff: Are you CD mixing routinely these days?

Danny Rampling: “Yes I am, CD mixing is brilliant for travelling. Obviously I still take some vinyl on the road but nowhere near as much as before, I used to carry two 35kg bags whereas now I take a small bag plus CDs. I have embraced CD mixing fully and I see lots of other DJs have done too. Three years ago people still weren’t keen on it whereas now I’d say 90% of DJs out there use CDs. It’s definitely the way forward.”

Skrufff: Do you own an Ipod?

Danny Rampling: “No, I don’t. I have no shame in saying I don’t have one yet either.”

Skrufff: You link to a few charities on your website, how do you choose which charities to support?

Danny Rampling: “My heart lies with Nelson Mandela’s Children’s Fund and the Terrence Higgins Trust. Both those two are very close to my heart. I’ve chosen those just through life experiences and becoming aware of situations in South Africa when I visited there 8 years ago. The Terrence Higgins Trust came because I lost a lot of friends, probably ten friends over four or five years, during the mid 90s (to AIDS). The Terrence Higgins Trust is a great charity, they also help Africa, and the people that work there are so passionate about what they do.”

Skrufff: You were a regular down at Trade in the 90s, do you ever listen to hard dance music these days?

Danny Rampling: “Yeah, sometimes, I could still go down to the beach, take a trip and go ballistic, sure (chuckling). If it’s played in the right space and there’s a good atmosphere then sure I can enjoy it. But actually listening to trance at home? No.”

Skrufff: Do you still go raving?

Danny Rampling: “No I don’t, not in the way I used to. I partied hard for England for about 20 years, major partying, and I think I’ve done pretty well to come out of that experience still in one piece. When I look back on some of the positions I was putting myself in, now that I have a child, it horrifies me. I think ‘My god, how could I have been so reckless?’ But that’s the lifestyle we were living at the time. I like to party, but my levels of partying are not the way they used to be, and I’m happy about that.”

Skrufff: Did you ever get arrested or seriously ill during those drug days?

Danny Rampling: “Nothing major. In terms of being arrested, thank God, no, though I was never a person who did things that made me majorly liable for arrest. I was once caught with an E in my pocket on Charing Cross Road (Central London) and taken to the police station, where they threw it away. I got off lightly there, that was back in 1988.”

Skrufff: What do you make of this renewed culture of people dressing flamboyantly and gay and straight clubbers mingling again?

Danny Rampling: “That’s very positive, in terms of myself wearing makeup, I don’t look very fetching in it (chuckling) so you won’t be seeing me out and about all done up. But in terms of what’s happening in London, it’s about diversity, and it’s great to have that diversity here in this city. It’s such an exciting, vibrant place already and to have that diversity going on is brilliant. If people want to express themselves flamboyantly or whatever way they choose, we should celebrate that. There’s enough dullness in this world and people who want to celebrate style and look unusual are brilliant.”

Skrufff: You’re a born and bred Londoner, do you ever think of leaving?

Danny Rampling: “From time to time I think about moving out, I day dream about moving to the South of France or Ibiza, but my heart lies here. And every time I return home from an overseas trip I’m happy to be back. This country takes a lot of criticism. I’m finding it hard to be away from my baby. It gets to you on the road, particularly when you have children. I’m trying to establish something in London that I can build on for my future. That’s also part of the reason for doing this club Union.”

http://www.dannyrampling.co.uk (Union opens on Saturday May 1, at the Cross, London: guest DJs include Dave Lee (aka Joey Negro) and New York veteran DJ Romain (of Limelight, Tunnel fame).

Interview By: Jonty Skrufff (Skrufff.com)

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Details

Published: 06 August 2004

Why I Hate Huge Egos (And Love Being a Casual) “I don’t like egotistical people; I don’t like huge egos out of control, all that being treated as someone special with your huge entourages being whisked off to VIP rooms type of thing. I find that attitude a real turn off. That’s why I don’t do much press, because I don’t like talking about myself all the time.

Chatting down the line from his London studio Pet Shop Boy producer Chris Lowe, is surprisingly (and thankfully) extremely chatty despite his well-known dislike of publicity and being recognised. He’s also remarkably down to Earth, particularly given that with his PSB partner Neil Tennant he belongs to Britain’s most successful pop duo of all time. Not that he’d see it that way, in terms of fame, money or even whether he’s a pop star, at least in the usual sense of the term.

“I’ve never sought fame or public recognition. I think one of the qualities many pop stars have, which is why they are what they are, is because they have huge egos, whereas I’m actually against the whole concept of ego,” he explains. “Everything I do tends to be contradictory.”

One thing he’s less contradictory about his music, which remains an abiding passion some 20 years into his career.

‘I’ve always loved going in the studio, having fun and seeing what comes out of it. We’re always working though I would probably like to work less but Neil likes to be busy all the time, I’m a lazy git, and I’d be quite happy to disappear for two years to go trekking but our diaries are always pretty full,” says Chris.

“I think that’s a good thing really, because otherwise you just disappear. When you stop or go away it’s so easy to lose touch with what’s going on in England, even if you go away for a three week holiday you’ve lost the plot. I don’t know how these superstar DJs manage to travel around the world and still keep in touch with what’s happening. I think it’s good to keep on top of it all.”

Skrufff (Jonty Skrufff): You recently released another PSBs Greatest Hits album as well as your current single Flamboyant, do you feel like you starting a new phase of the Pet Shop Boys?

Pet Shop Boys: “What’s different about now is that we’ve really been inspired by the electroclash scene, it’s rejuvenated our interest in clubbing again. House music lasted a very long time (laughing) and I was always a huge fan but I think we were ready for something new to come along. I can’t deny the electroclash scene has been an influence on Flamboyant for example. The other factor is that now you can get all these virtual analogue keyboards that we used to use in the 80s. You can now get them as plug-ins so that’s also given us a whole new impetus, we’ve been able to access all these great old sounds that we used to use and do more with them in the computer. Those two factors have come together for us to start producing more electronic sounding music again.”

Skrufff: George Michael was talking recently of a dreadful creative block he had, saying he was worried he couldn’t write anymore, do you ever go through that kind of emotion?

Pet Shop Boys: “He’s never been very prolific, has he? I imagine that almost every song he’s written is on an album, whereas with us you often get an album’s worth of songs with each single. We’ve never had creative blocks, I’ve always loved going in the studio, having fun and seeing what comes out of it. No doubt that could happen at some point. All songwriters are supposed to have a ten year period of writing good stuff then after that it’s all over, though we’re 18 years in.”

Skrufff: You’ve had number one hits throughout your career, what criteria do you judge success by these days, are you judging by chart positions?

Pet Shop Boys: “Charts are a different side of success. There are two elements, the success of the record creatively, ie whether the record has an emotional impact on the listener then there’s the chart thing. Both Neil and I would still love to be at the top end of the charts all the time and we still manage that, Miracles was top 10 but we’re doing it these days without mass media coverage, which is actually quite a struggle. England’s quite a strange place in the sense that the media will suddenly decide they’ve had enough of you and move on whereas in other countries it’s different. That’s a fair enough attitude if the artist has lost it or has stopped making good music but I think we’re still producing good music personally.”

Skrufff: DJ Hell’s recently remixed West End Girls, how do you feel about other producers reworking your version, do you feel in any way competitive?

Pet Shop Boys: “Oh no, I get totally excited by it. We almost always choose the remixers and I find it very exciting to hear how someone else interprets your song and giving it a more clubby feel. I think DJ Hell’s mix is great, he’s done it really punky and all the sounds are very dry. I think it’s quite shocking.”

Skrufff: Is Hell someone you know personally?

Pet Shop Boys: “I’ve only met him very briefly in the DJ booth at Nag, Nag, Nag last year. I remember reading about some famous party he had in Barcelona. He also designed a special label for West End Girls. I really like the whole aesthetic of Gigolo Records.”

Skrufff: Do you know electroclash-man Larry Tee in New York, he’s just opened a new club at Pyramid, on Avenue A?

Pet Shop Boys: “Pyramid’s back? That’s good because I thought clubbing was over in New York. I can’t believe what they’ve done to New York nightlife in the last few years though I’m sure we’ll follow suit here in England. I hope if they do try and bring those rules in over here, that there’s some sort of uprising.”

Skrufff: What do you make of the puritan anti-club culture attitude prevalent in the States currently?

Pet Shop Boys: “I just don’t understand it at all. New York advertises itself as a 24 hour vibrant city but when you remove that night-time element from it, there’s not a lot left; it’s just a boring city with tall buildings. It’s a lot safer admittedly. I remember being near the Port Authority Bus Terminal in the mid 80s and it was terrifying. There was a very interesting club there, actually in the Port Authority Bus Terminal. Though I’m actually in favour of the no smoking ban (bursting with laughter). I’m a massive contradiction. You just cherry pick the bits you like but I do like going to a club and not stinking (of tobacco) when I get home. I think there should be smoking areas in clubs, that’d be a good compromise. Another outcome of all these rules could be to make the scene more underground again, the beginning of the rave scene, for example, was totally illegal and it was fantastic. I loved all of that.”

Skrufff: Were you going raving through all the Shroom days of the late 80s?

Pet Shop Boys: “Yes. Though what I really liked doing was driving up to places like Walthamstow (North-East London) looking for raves and seeing a lad standing by the road, with an arrow, saying ‘this way’. I used to love all those raves and warehouse parties. I remember touring round the UK at the time when the rave scene hadn’t spread outside London and Manchester and being shocked at seeing people still going to old fashioned clubs.”

Skrufff: You grew up in Blackpool, a northern party city with quite a tough reputation .

Pet Shop Boys: “Blackpool certainly can be quite a violent place though I think Blackpool, and actually every town centre in England, is more violent now than it was in my day, though maybe that’s because I’ve turned into a soft southerner. When you go outside London, you do think ‘Gor blimey, how scary is this?’ I went to watch Arsenal in the FA Cup Final in Cardiff, for example, and, my God, Cardiff on a Saturday night, Wow!’  It’s got an incredible air of violence and aggression that I don’t remember when I was younger.”

Skrufff: We’re you born in Blackpool?

Pet Shop Boys: “I was born there and grew up near the Pleasure Beach (Blackpool’s rollercoaster theme park). The Pleasure Beach was literally at the end of my road so it was great to hear the noise of the rollercoaster. The good thing about growing up in Blackpool was that you spent all your time hanging round amusement arcades. I also used to go to a club called Man Fridays which had plastic palm trees, during the disco era, and I did odd jobs as a glass collector. I remember seeing a horrible fight once on Central Pier, when this lad was getting his head kicked in by about a dozen other lads, it was such a horrible sight.

One of the things I always liked about the rave scene was that it wasn’t about violence; it was about love and that was a huge change. Because people forget nowadays that the only time that men ever went on the dance floor before the rave scene was at the end of an evening, to chat up a girl. Men never used to dance; they’d stand round the edge of the dance floor while the girls danced around their handbags. Lots of people won’t remember that far back.”

Skrufff: You were in London during the New Romantic era of 1981/ 82 when people like Boy George and Steve Strange were all over the club scene, were you also going out on that scene?

Pet Shop Boys: “Me and Neil were there but we weren’t really part of it, we were more like observers on the periphery. I found that whole New Romantic era so exciting, I’ve always loved people dressing up and being flamboyant and going against the norm, but I’m just not one of those people who does it. Even though I admire it so much in other people.”

Skrufff: Were you ever tempted to try it out?

Pet Shop Boys: “No, I wasn’t tempted at all, the only time I’ve ever dressed up is as a Pet Shop Boy. Everything I do tends to be contradictory. My favourite fashion clothes during the new romantic days were casual. I loved the casuals, and loved having a Fioruccci top and Tacchini jeans and even now I still like Stone Island. I’ve never been into wearing make-up either, it’s just not me, but I’ve always liked going to those clubs where people do. I went to the opening night of the Camden Palace in 1982, Steve Strange’s night, and went there wearing a sweat shirt and a pair of jeans; I don’t know how I got in. There were people dressed in amazing costumes being turned away but for some reason they let me in.”

Skrufff: I read in on old Guinness Book of Rock Stars that you were dropped by CBS in 1984 when West End Girls was first released, after it failed to chart. . .

Pet Shop Boys: “We weren’t dropped, what happened was, we had a one single deal.”

Skrufff: Did you lose faith at all when the song failed to make the charts the first time round?

Pet Shop Boys: “No, because although it got a little play on Radio 1it amazingly got a huge amount of play on K Roc in Los Angeles and was their screamer of the year, in other words, their biggest record of the year, and had a huge impact so we still thought the song had something. So then when we signed to Parlophone we went on to re-record it. You never know when you’re going to have success. When you haven’t had any success, you can’t imagine ever having it, because you can’t imagine that the radio stations will ever play your records. So when it does happen, it’s amazing.”

Skrufff: How easy was it to avoid going off the rails, when you achieved number one hits?

Pet Shop Boys: “We were both quite old when we started, I’d already finished six years of university, so we weren’t young, though I don’t know if that makes you more sensible or not. I’m not such an excessive kind of person anyway, I don’t have an addictive personality, my brain and my body have real cut-off points, which says ‘go to bed’. I know people who’ve had problems and they don’t seem to have that cut-off point, they go out on a Friday and they’re still out on Monday afternoon. I like sleeping too much, I love going to bed. I think that’s a real safety valve.”

Skrufff: Some pop stars talk of fame and worldwide success as being hollow when they get it, whereas you seem quite fulfilled by the whole thing, has money brought you happiness?

Pet Shop Boys: “Money? Money doesn’t bring you happiness though it’s nice not to have to worry about it too much, which isn’t the same thing as happiness. That sounds terrible to someone who’s sleeping on the streets. Happiness is a very complicated issue and it’s not simply related to money. I’ve never sought fame or public recognition. I think one of the qualities many pop stars have, which is why they are what they are, is because they have huge egos. I’m actually against the whole concept of ego, I don’t like egotistical people, I don’t like huge egos out of control, being treated as special with your huge entourages being whisked to VIP rooms. I find that attitude a real turn off. That’s why I don’t do much press, because I don’t like talking about me all the time. When you think about those huge rock stars with their huge egos, if that’s the only thing that’s driving them, then maybe that’s why they’re not fulfilled ultimately.”

Skrufff: Do you feel a sense of drive to keep on going long term with the Pet Shop Boys?

Pet Shop Boys: “God yeah, we’re really driven, we love doing what we do and we love writing songs. We’re into it, we still watch Pop World on a Sunday.”

Skrufff: Any relationship is difficult to maintain for 20 years, how easy has it been to maintain your relationship with Neil?

Pet Shop Boys: “I’ve not really thought about it, we get on. Neil’s really funny and good company and we have the same interests. I think the main thing is that we enjoy working together. I read something about Michael Stipe saying REM could only function if they spend a lot of time apart and I thought ‘well, why bother?’”

Pet Shop Boys’ Flamboyant is out now on Parlophone (as is their latest Greatest Hits compilation PopArt: The Hits.

http://www.petshopboys.co.uk

Interview by: Skrufff.com

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